How Should We Record "Alternate Beginning"
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Keep it as Alternate Ending because if we change it here to Alternate Beginning, what would be label the Alternate Ending from Albany as (since there was no ETS before or after). Definitely a horror for stats as well
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@Cody I was thinking about that earlier, but it would still be AE because it came out of Bee Jam. I can see it noted differently for simplicity, but if it starts a segue of songs...I like Alternate Beginning
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@603Brett said in How Should We Record "Alternate Beginning":
@Cody I was thinking about that earlier, but it would still be AE because it came out of Bee Jam. I can see it noted differently for simplicity, but if it starts a segue of songs...I like Alternate Beginning
That's definitely a fair argument! Maybe there is a solution in the middle that we could conjure up!
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@Cody Alternate Middle it is!
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Not the same situation but the Reprise didn't become the Intro once it stopped being America Reprise, it still kept it's name regardless of placement.
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Change the name to “Alternate Names Based on Placement or Preference” Problem solved.
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I was down with having both AE and AB at first, especially because they typed it up that way. But Im gonna have to agree that when you throw the Albany version in and consider the fact that more versions like that will probably be seen in the future, it starts to get messy.
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@damian I think it is a troubling question and I understand the reasoning against the change so let me be devil's advocate. I don't think a change would risk "infecting" all the other songs... ATW will always be ATW wherever it is placed because it is not named ATW-Ending. AE is the only song in their catalogue that is defined in its very name as a "located" song and has always appeared in the location of its name. It seems fitting to celebrate its relocation with a renaming... ? AE and AB will always be related, they will always appear back to back in alpha ordered song directories. As for the "middle" question, I think it's only a problem when there is no ETS. Whenever ETS shares the set list it is AE or AB in relation to ETS. Sans ETS, the determination could be made if it is he hard-start or hard-finish of a series. Or if the band cntinues to distinguish AEs and ABs on set lists, then that would be the guide. If it is a one-off thing and never happens again, then seems silly to rename it.
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@Johnny-Love by that logic, what is The Reprise? It was originally America Reprise and still sits there sometimes... But when it doesn't should when just call it "The"?
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@damian yes! No, kidding aside and devils advocate hat unrelinquished, the reprise is an independent entity from America thus can be detached and keep its name regardless of location. AE and AB are identical, so as they say in the restaurant biz: location, location, location.
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I think we should call it Alternate Spaffording. Then it goes at beginnings and ends whenever they want, and it always fits.
This idea looks surprisingly stupid in writing.
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@SassyPete correction - this brilliant idea makes writing look surprisingly stupid
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@Johnny-Love but the Reprise wasn't always independent of America, it was America Reprise for a little while.
Alternate used to be the actual ending of taco stand but once ETS got reworked the "alternate ending" then took on its own life
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@Lopez mind = blown
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@damian alternate bridge
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@dr_rock where's that confounded alternate bridge?
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It should just remain alternate ending with a note
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The Ending Previously Known as Alternate
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Perhaps it should be tracked however the official Nugs release tracks it. I know it takes a little while for them to release so, at first, just track it as Alternate Ending. It IS the same song regardless of placement so I'm not really sure why it would have a different name. Although, now that I look at the Nugs release for the Madison show, they officially tracked it as Alternate Beginning. Ah what confusion! Maybe somebody can inquire with the band at a show.
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@BushCow They also track "Jam" songs which we've decided to generally avoid. I'm thinking a LOT about stats here and the question becomes is "Alternate Beginning" stat worthy (beyond the note on the song). I mean, have you seen 5 Alternate Endings and 1 Alternate Beginning?
The general consensus seems to be that it is going to be Alternate Ending* where *="Labeled as Alternate Beginning". The good news is that we should be able to track this stuff down later if it becomes apparent that it needs to be changed.
You know, there's a field in the dataset that you guys can't see called "Other Names" (or something like that). Songs like In The Eyes Of Thieves have entries there for "Chocolate Beef", and All In has an entry for "Combo Combo".
EDIT: I'm amending the text above to be accurate, but I want to capture that I mistakenly said Ain't That Wrong was once called Chocolate Beef, that way @Lopez's comment below still makes sense.
